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Post Info TOPIC: Security Door... No Studs... Please help!


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Security Door... No Studs... Please help!


Hi,

Thanks to anyone that replys.  I'll just jump right to it.

I have this security door that is supposed to go right over my outside molding.  The problem is the drill did not hit any studs and I would need another inch and a half that I don't have to hit them.  I did the measurements properly before ordering the door, and I figured the studs would be in the normal place, but they are not.

The only thing I can come up with is to drill some larger holes and fill the very large gap with Great Stuff so the security door mount doesn't crack the molding.  I'm thinking the Great Stuff will act as glue between the stud and the molding.

One other problem.  I can't really peal off the molding because I have stucco and I'd like to avoid the nightmare of a paint match which would most likely result in me having to paint my whole house.

 



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got a pic of it. that allways helps. there mite be a way to add to the outside trim for that door. it does really help to see these things. im sure we can figger it out. we generally kick things around and come up with a fix. by the way , welcome to the handyman.

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The moldings are 1" and seem very solid.  I looked at a couple of installation videos, and they don't really mention anything about hitting the studs.  I'm just really woried the moldings would crack with all the weight basically sitting on one molding.



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First off WELCOME to the handy man show,,, Now to the important stuff,,,, If I am soaking this up correctly,, this security door attaches directly to the entry door wood trim,  Correct?  really if this trim is of suffcent thickness , to hold the screws , it should be ok,, but not REALLY very secure,, ( burgler proof)

The trim covers the attaching screws, and simply peels off pretty easy,, ( But gives you " piece of mind "per say)

as for the molding being strong enough to hold the weight of the door,, just be sure there is a solid surface for the Butt (hinge ) side of the S/door to sit on, thats where the weight or the entire door is ,,and if the floor is level under the entry door ,which is should be , both sides of the S/door will be on a solid surface,,,  if not  , just shim up under the sides , to support the weight of the door,,,

another way would be to use anchors to attach the s/door to the trim,  instead of nails  and long enough to go through the plaster and into the void behind the trim,  that way it would give it alot more support

http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-100337651/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=wall+anckors&storeId=10051  let us know how things work out,,

hope you drop back by and join us , and get involved with the group,, we are just a bunch of old codgers, retired, carpenters , electricans ETC ,, bored, and spend way too much time B.S'n here,, but we have fun....

Hope this help,,,biggrin



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Thanks!

Well, wall anchors aren't really an option for 2 reasons.  I don't want someone being able to take my security door off with a screw driver (one way screws) and the bar-stock for the door butt is an inch and a half thick.  The door basically would sit like a topper on the most outer part of the trim (molding to my dad) with a width about 2" wider than the opening of the door.  Sorry, I know I wasn't very clear on this.  And I live in Arizona, where houses are built a little differently.  The trim doesn't go all the way to the ground (if you look really hard you can see it in the blury picture I attached).  This is because the house is built on a post-tensioned concrete slab to float around on the sand (and very agressive termites).  It is very solid... we don't know how, but even trying to get some leverage with the pry bar and it isn't budging it and we don't want to push much harder because we are sure it will crack.

But I think its secure enough to hold the weight of the S/door, so I'm gonna drill a couple of holes and fill it up with great stuff to add some structural integrity.  I think I knew this from the beginning, but I was looking for some moral support on it.

Thanks for the welcome.  I'm not so old, but I like to ask those with experience before I try something new.  My Dad is a carpenter and lives with me but is experiencing a case of the "I don't knows" because of the way these homes were built compaired to the homes he built in the midwest.  I'm a robotics engineer, and have always just asked my dad when it came to stuff like this.  Home automation, appliance repair, fix you garage door opener, heck even fix a playstation... no problem, but when I expect to hit a stud and don't.... I'm lost.



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Yep I know how homes were built in Arizona,, I was in Mesa for a few years,( long time ago) too damn hot for me,, so I went back to Colorado.. now in Oregon

now back to the door, There are special screws that are used on the security doors,  once you screw them in there is no way to remove them,, cause the slot for the screw driver is a one way deal.. no reverse in other words,, or takes a special tool,,, that Great stuff you mentioned   is that the same as spray expanding foam?

http://www.tamperproof.com/categories/products.html

as for the door reaching the deck,, is there a difference in the height of the entry door, and the s/door? a narrow  filler under the s/door won't show much,, you could paint it to match the color of the door trim  or what ever, Its hard to come to a solution  on something like this,, all we can do is give ideas,, but it sounds like you have it covered pretty well,,, the reason for holding the trim up off the deck, is to prevent dry rot, termites Etc,, and weather proofing,

I was a carpenter for over 45 years, 30 of that was as a commercial contractor,, now I ain't much of anything,, but I'm loving ever minute of it, probably just like your dad isbiggrin

 


 



 



 



-- Edited by Bad Rat on Thursday 20th of September 2012 02:18:24 AM

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G'morn and Welcome to the Forum, Lumbarkod !

After reading these posts, my first thought was this:

If you added a metal strip all the way around  the

top and sides of the security door, would it extend

out wide enuff to allow you to drill new hole in the

strips and, therefore, attaching it to a stud?  You

could use those special non-removal screws like

Bad Rat mentioned also.

 

I hope I explained myself well enuff, if not, then let

me know and I'll try to draw up a sketch of some kind.

Good Luck,

meller



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Thanks, we (my dad and I) discussed this too, and I we are doing a bit of a hybrid.  I'm going to start welding some  4x4" 12 guage plates to the back of the frame of the door inbetween the lag holes.  Then fill the gap with Great Stuff (Expanding Poly E foam) and mount both to the door and hit the stud with the plates. I'll rout the trim first so the plates are flush.   I have some trim paint left over so then Ill just have to paint the plates the same color as the trim.  I think its a little hillbilly, but my dad says "sometimes you need a little hillbilly."  I'll give it a ram test and see how it holds up to my 270 lb smash.  If I can break it dad says he'll pay for a professional fix.

I'll send a picture of the broken shoulder or door.



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hahaha, good luck. oh yeah, a vid of that door test would be a hoot !!

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Sounds like a plan to me - - - - BTW, hillbilly or redneck (as we say in Tejas) it's all good if it does the job.

Now whatcha gonna do if you just dent it with the ram test but it still holds tight  hmmmmm, it's a thought ain't it but at 270 you shouldn't have too many folks wanting to break into your digs.



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